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New Paypal Privacy Policy

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DaveB View Drop Down
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    Posted: 17 April 2010 at 7:14pm
Hi All,
Like most people, I have a privacy policy on my site that states I will not give away my customer details to anyone. However, PayPal has just decided to give our customer details to a marketing company from next month - they have explained that we have the choice of (basically) "getting lost" otherwise.

Am I the only one to be furious about that or are others (like me) now looking for a payment gateway provider with a responsible privacy policy (any suggestions)?
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raineshoe View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote raineshoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 April 2010 at 7:15pm
I've not seen anything about this yet, but wouldn't be too happy.

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DaveB View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DaveB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 April 2010 at 7:33pm
Hi Raineshoe,
They sent me a notification a few days ago pointing to their new Privacy Policy from 1st June that they "may disclose certain PayPal customer information" to....

"Carrenza Limited

To store user data for marketing campaigns."

and mention
Name, e-mail, address, business name, domain name, account status, type and nature of PayPal services offered or used and relevant transaction information. It is not clear whether that is just my information or my customers and I'm waiting for a reply to a complaint (don't hold your breath).
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wigman View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wigman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 April 2010 at 11:01pm
Hi DaveB,
We recieved the notice about the new Paypal User Agreement, when looking at the agreement and the Privacy Policy I too noticed the part about Carrenza Limited.
If you don't agree to the new Paypal agreement you have to cancel your account, what an horrible company they are (Paypal) trouble is a lot of customers use them so you don't know what to do for the best.
Here is the notice:

Credit Reference and Fraud Agencies
RSA Security Inc. and RSA Security Ireland Limited      To verify identity       All account information

Marketing and public relations
Yesmail Inc. (USA) and Responsys (USA)
To fulfil e-mail marketing programs of PayPal services and promotions.
Name, e-mail, address, business name, domain name, account status, account preferences, type and nature of PayPal services offered or used and relevant transaction and account information.

Carrenza Limited      To store user data for marketing campaigns. Name, e-mail, address, business name, domain name, account status, account preferences, type and nature of PayPal services offered or used and relevant transaction information.

Operational services
Transcom Worldwide (UK) Limited (UK), Newman & Company Limited (UK),
To collect debt      Name, address, date of birth, telephone number, account number, e-mail, account type, account status, last four digits of financial instruments account, account balance, details of account transactions and liabilities, name of funding source provider.

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raineshoe View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote raineshoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 April 2010 at 8:11am
I'll be looking for the note about it. Tend not to read everything from Paypal as there is so much drivel that comes through.

However, we are signed up to the telephone preference service and fax preference service so if I start getting unsolicited marketing/advertising calls through this I shall be on it like a ton of bricks. Also, if they start e-mailing you can refer it to the Information Commissioners Office. They don't have legal powers as such, but can tackle companies about spam e-mails etc.

You may be able to complain to the Information Commissioners Office about this with Paypal.

I don't like Paypal much either as I think they favour the purchaser too much. Not that I've ever had a problem, but have heard of alleged incidents whereby buyer has claimed they've not received goods and even when the seller has proof they were posted and signed for etc Paypal still side with the buyer and refund regardless.

Like Mike said though an awful lot of customers like them. Unfortunately Paypal was quick to jump on the bandwaggon of relatively cheap international money transfer making it quick and easy. Others were too slow to follow and so they swept up the whole market. For a long time they were the only option.

This is partly why I want to try Google checkout as an option, but looking at my cart which currently takes Nochex and Paypal the clear leader is Paypal although from what I can gather Nochex would love to pinch all their customers.

Edited by raineshoe - 18 April 2010 at 8:19am
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raineshoe View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote raineshoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 April 2010 at 8:23am
Just interested do you guys use Paypal Pro or Paypal Standard as I just use the Standard.

I am looking at using Sagepay in the future and may drop Paypal in favour of this. Its an ongoing consideration for me at the moment. Unfortunately, I take ages to make up my mind about things like this so it rolls into months before I actually do anything. When I asked on the forum a lot of people liked Paypal Pro which can do all of what Sagepay does and for similar money, but like you guys say don't like their tactics.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DaveB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 April 2010 at 8:07pm
Hi Raineshoe,

We just use PayPal standard. However, once the news gets around I can see some (perhaps many) customers avoiding those sites that use Paypal (and I wouldn't blame them - I'll probably be starting a campaign with any site I wanted to use that used PayPal).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Silent_Explorer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 April 2010 at 11:07pm
Hi Folks,

I've just sent the following email to business-support@paypal.co.uk

Could I suggest that any other PayPal users with similar concerns should also convey their feelings to PayPal

Quote PayPal Business Support,

Following comments from large numbers of PayPal users on the RomanCart discussion forum
regarding recent changes to the PayPal Privacy Policy I've been reading your new PayPal User
Agreement and and I'm alarmed by the section in the Privacy Policy changes about your intension
to disclose confidential information about our customers to third parties such as Yesmail Inc. (USA)
Responsys and Carrenza Limited for use in their marketing campaigns.

I regard the above action to be in breach of customer confidentiality and if PayPal intends to
disclose confidential information about our customers to third parties this may leave me with
no alternative than to make alternative arrangements for all our on-line payment processing.

I'm sorry your company regards it more important to sell confidential information about our
customers to third parties than concentrate on providing a payment processing solution

Your comments would be appreciated

Best Regards,

Nick G.
Amourelle Products Ltd

The Garage Door Spares & Automation Specialists - open your garage door at the press of a button !
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raineshoe View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote raineshoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 April 2010 at 8:20am
Excellent Nick.

Probably fall on deaf ears where Paypal are concerend but definitely worth a shot.

Wonder who the CEO is as that is the best place to direct complaints as he is the one that can take action.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DaveB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 April 2010 at 8:18pm
I've just received an answer from PayPal regarding my "why are you busting my customer privacy policy" question (that I posted on their website) saying that policy changes are "prompted by user feedback and our ongoing work to make the product better suit user requirements" and by "Other changes are made in response to changes in the legal and regulatory environment".

I told them I could think of no way that these would be reasons for breaching customer confidentiality (both of their customers AND mine) and thanking them for their helpful re-statement of my option to take it or leave it.

So, no-one's listening. However I shall follow Nick's advice and post something similar to the business email contact he identified. Time to start spreading the word AND looking for a more responsible gateway I think.
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